| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| nightbird |
Posted - 22/05/2007 : 23:50:04
http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6678915.stm?dynamic_vote=ON#vote_road_pricing_trial
Why choose such a costly way I ask, wouldn't it would be better to put the burden on pump prices than expensive technology.
That way nobody escapes, the more you use your car the more you will pay |
| 27 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Daveb |
Posted - 28/05/2007 : 09:35:33
Must be all those chain gangs! |
| gcrkfrd |
Posted - 28/05/2007 : 04:36:15
Here, the Free Highways, are better maintained, than the Toll Roads.
Comparing, the Interstates, in Missouri, and Arkansas, to the toll Interstate Highways in Kansas, and Oklahoma. |
| camelot |
Posted - 26/05/2007 : 01:46:54
quote:
Originally posted by avro
Camelot, what happens if you do not have the transponder
when you pass the loop?
Yes, FUBAR has it correct. When it was introduced we already had toll roads with automatic gate machines and people in collection booths for those without exact coin. The problem was massive fuel wasting traffic snarls as each person had to toss their coins into a hopper.
(The closest I ever came to road rage was when a woman in the car in front of mine in an automatic coin lane gave the coins to "little Johnnie" to toss. Of course he missed by a good margin and then they all climbed out of the vehicle to find the coins whilst I and others were trapped behind them in the heart of “rush hour” traffic. )
That cannot happen to those lanes that now have the transponder readers. Traffic moves at posted speed without stopping at all. Those without the IPASS need to use the old coin booths and come to a full stop on the side of the road. SO at least in that respect they have been a blessing. But they do record everything and I can get a detailed record of the charges complete with time and date and toll reader location. The BIG question here was/is can they start using it for speeding violations? The system can easily compute time/distance to show speed between two points. They already have billing info for the fine and a picture for verification.;(
Brings to mind another of our traffic devices…traffic signal cameras that automatically send out fine for going thru red light...Do yuo have them as well???
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/01/22/earlyshow/main2381713.shtml |
| Fluffy Sheep |
Posted - 26/05/2007 : 01:37:34
I don`t HAVE a mobile phone as I don`t know how to use one.... I quite unintentionally killed my daughter`s tamagochi years ago, with the same Luddite trait...and I don`t want a mobile
They can track me any other way, but not that.
Toll roads, I have to say I think if you want the easier route and can pay/don`t mind paying, last year we drove to Northampton and the Toll road bit was worth every penny of an extra few quid. Kept us out of other folks` way too. See the point though, we pay enough already. Still, you pays yer money and takes yer choice. |
| FUBAR |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 19:46:34
The obvious solution is that we all swap cars and mobile phones......and rubbish bins..... |
| n/a |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 16:05:43
Better that we enjoy cheap motoring for the next 3 years
then buy rollerskates |
| Daveb |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 13:50:13
There is more to this than just charges.
I am becoming convinced (paranoid) that it is about tracking movements.
They already do this with mobile phones.
If they have this in cars you will have no freedom of movement.
If it goes further and the black box in your car can be used to immobilise the car just think what can be done!  |
| nightbird |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 13:13:47
Pay-as-you-go, don't we do that already with car tax, fuel tax, parking charges and fines.
How many more ingenious methods are they going to come up with to bleed the motorist dry ? |
| FUBAR |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 12:50:24
If it works the same as Toronto a picture is taken of the license plate and you are tracked down and a bill sent for the charge. What we will have is a road system that we paid for being run by private industry for their profit. Refusal and non compliance is the only tool we as people have left. Our views and opinions count for nothing with the so called "political elite", you will do as they command as they know what is best for us all........  |
| n/a |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 10:53:37
Camelot, what happens if you do not have the transponder
when you pass the loop? |
| camelot |
Posted - 25/05/2007 : 01:30:31
quote:
Originally posted by FUBAR
We are completely wasting our time complaining about road pricing. ....
I could almost hear the tea being dumped into Boston Harbour as I read your post! But I do feel your pain...and agree it is almost a certainty. When forced to commute to the "loop" in Chicago other than by train I can drive with my IPASS transponder attached to the windscreen, where it will confidently deduct $ from my credit card as I pass thru the overhead sensors. Painless really, you don't even feel anything till the end of the month, and soooo easy to use! Also, as an added benefit, the records of time and place of passing can be subpoenaed by the courts, as was one women’s records during a divorce case… |
| n/a |
Posted - 24/05/2007 : 23:58:54
You are being heard |
| Miriam Binder |
Posted - 24/05/2007 : 15:35:02
quote:
Originally posted by gcrkfrd
1984
"Until they become conscious they will never rebel, and until after they they have rebelled they cannot become conscious."
- George Orwell, 1984, Book 1, Chapter 7 |
| gcrkfrd |
Posted - 24/05/2007 : 15:04:11
1984 |
| n/a |
Posted - 24/05/2007 : 13:22:24
A new era in satellite navigation has begun with the launch of Giove-A....
Giove-A will demonstrate key technologies needed for Galileo, the 3.4bn-euro (£2.3bn; $4bn) sat-nav system Europe hopes to deploy by 2010....
Galileo will deliver the tools national governments need to introduce wide-scale road charging.
|
| n/a |
Posted - 24/05/2007 : 10:21:39
Fubar, Road pricing will be throughout Europe.
If a vehicle is illegal it will be stopped at one of many checkpoints.
The vehicle and its contents will be confiscated and the driver summoned to court.
We are already in a big brother society, its just subtle at the moment. |
| Daveb |
Posted - 24/05/2007 : 06:24:03
How about a car protest?
Drive very slowly through Brighton and cause gridlock.
Or is that just a normal day?
Of coursr all this talk of road pricing could be a smoke screen.
If it is cancelled, we all sigh with relief and welcome the £6 litre. It will not seem so bad after all! |
| nightbird |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 17:12:44
Whats this obsession with CCTV,just don't get it......
http://motoring.aol.co.uk/motoring-news/video-cameras-for-traffic-wardens/article/20070523092009990001 |
| Miriam Binder |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 17:03:41
Poll tax wasn't reversed on civil war but on large scale civil disobedience ... though I must admit the concept of obedience sits somewhere ill at ease with the concept of democracy. In essence Fubar is right, we are governed by consent and therefore laws are also enacted by our consent. Withdraw consent and the law will fail. |
| long time no see |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 15:50:24
Yes Civil War.
The Police are Downsized. |
| FUBAR |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 15:35:20
We are completely wasting our time complaining about road pricing. It will happen even if every person in the land signed a petition against it. The only way to fight it is the poll tax method, complete refusal to co-operate. Back box in your car sir--no thanks, got a box-- it must be broken, bill through the post--sent back not at this address, bill comes back--I wasn't driving on that road at that time please check, another bill--wait for the red one, still a bill--go to court, court --no thanks still won't pay....Laws survive by OUR agreement, can they lock us ALL up or take us all to court. This is road clearing for the rich. It will be the middle class law abiding families who pay for this not the poor or rich who will get subsidised travel one way or another. Write to your MP and say if they vote for this you will NEVER vote for them......... |
| moon23 |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 13:56:03
quote:
Originally posted by nightbird
We must appose this, the Government intend to make it national have no doubts about it.
The technology will enable further stealth surveillance on citizens, they will no exactly what your movements are, they will probably sell the information to employers to keep track of their staff ?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6382211.stm
Yes, no more slacking on company time.
More survialliance |
| n/a |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 10:39:25
The Government idea is to reduce traffic not imagine
a 21st century road construction program.
Lack of ideas.
Time to change this stale load of blue labour for others
with vision. If they exist at all |
| nightbird |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 08:36:30
We must appose this, the Government intend to make it national have no doubts about it.
The technology will enable further stealth surveillance on citizens, they will no exactly what your movements are, they will probably sell the information to employers to keep track of their staff ?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6382211.stm |
| Miriam Binder |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 07:33:59
I agree Dom. The whole scheme is an abysmal and ill thought out attempt which ultimately shows what governments real concerns are; the raising of revenue rather then addressing real problems with real solutions. |
| dom |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 07:19:26
This is such a bad idea and I signed the petition on the 10 Downing Street site about this. I am also willing to march the streets about this, and I have never ever even thought about protesting before, not even about the war.
The map below is from BBC News. It was from a government think tank and showed what would happen with and what would happen without PAYG road tolls.
So effectively without road pricing London will grind to a halt. What kind of rubbish is this map? London is the only place in the country that ALREADY has road pricing yet they think road pricing will sort this? It won't make a difference as you already have to pay to get around London.
I also see that Beddingham will be at a standstill road pricing or not, yet the new bridge will be open by then, so it shows how sloppily researched this map is.
I make environmentally concious decisions when I buy a car and when I use it currently due to the cost of petrol. I specifically purchased a car with low petrol consumption (65mpg), low CO2 emmissions (£35 tax per year) and only use it to go to work. I can't use public transport for that, even though I want to (no criticism of public transport, I work in a strange place).
If I can use public transport I will. When I go to London or the airport, I use a train. I use the buses in Brighton. All of this because a road pricing scheme ALREADY EXISTS and it is called fuel duty.
Will the government drop tax on fuel with road pricing? Of course not. Will road pricing make a difference? No, do the government really think most people drive around for the sake of it and sit in traffic jams for hours because they want to?
Won't this scheme also push traffic into villages. I go along a dual carriageway to get to work but could easily drive across country through several villages to get to work and will do if it's cheaper. I suspect many others will too. |
| Daveb |
Posted - 23/05/2007 : 06:58:21
Far too sensible.
The £5 litre nearly brought the country to a standstill a couple of years back.
Perhaps they think this is a way avoiding rebellion.
Wrap it up in a nice green reason and you can get away with it.
Of course it would interesting to see if any ministers have interests in the companies that stand to gain from this. Oh, can we still do that since the FOI vote? |
