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nightbird
Calaspia
603 Posts |
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sparkie
Alagaësía
13 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2007 : 17:44:20
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Could be, but I imagine the decision has been made already as it's due to be announced before July 9 which is only 7 working days away. I doubt the minister waits until the last day to make the decision, and then it's hastily typed up, so it's probably already going through the system.
And the South Downs Park inspector recommends the whole site is outside the new park anyway, so the AONB status is living on borrowed time as it is, and the grounds for objection will crumble away. |
Edited by - sparkie on 28/06/2007 17:45:32 |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 19:08:47
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| Yep, delayed two weeks. |
We're all doomed!
Head for the hills before they start heading for you! |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 19:14:00
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| WHAT?????? Why? |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 19:18:44
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| Jesus wept! |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
 Posted - 04/07/2007 : 19:22:29
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I think the saying was
Jesus Saves
But Peter Ward gets the rebound! |
We're all doomed!
Head for the hills before they start heading for you! |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 19:23:54
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nightbird
Calaspia
603 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 21:41:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Miriam Binder
But why another delay, has somebody found a anomaly in Ruth Kelly's decision? |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2007 : 21:57:52
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| Maybe incoming Communities Secretary Hazel Blears wants to make her own decision? Or at least have it appear like her own decision? |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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nightbird
Calaspia
603 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 12:13:02
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Seeda have just given 5 million toward the stadium, thats priority for you when we have one of the largest house waiting lists in the south and cut backs in the NHS.
How did they no the outcome of Blears decision before the 19th I wonder......  |
Edited by - nightbird on 05/07/2007 12:23:11 |
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sully
Alagaësía
40 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 12:24:06
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I'm sure that Hazel Blears has a lot to look at as she takes over the department, and will want to ensure that she has fully reviewed and understood the decision before publishing it.
The last thing we want after all this time is for someone to object on the basis that she can't have considered it properly! That would surely be grounds for a judicial review.
This delay was always likely once the date of Gordon Brown's take over was known, and is a small price to pay for a more "water-tight" decision.
Let's just hope it's the right one, now!! |
Involved in Scouting?
Take part in the 40th Sussex Downsman Hike. 6 October 2007.
See www.downsman.com for details |
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FG1
Alagaësía
Wallis and Futuna Islands
37 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 12:54:52
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Lots of skullduggery going on here to try and save some marginal MPs.
Part of Falmer site removed from National Park. Toads Hole Valley added to National Park.
So the best site is removed from consideration and Falmer is doomed.
Who will walk to Falmer?
How will this stadium be a "Community" Stadium?
Albion will not want teams lower than the reserves playing on their grass. |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 13:06:24
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| Well, it will be up to the Albion to prove that it is a community stadium by their actions. I'm sure they will not let me, and countless others, down on this. |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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septicman
Alagaësía
77 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 12:10:21
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quote:
Originally posted by FG1
Lots of skullduggery going on here to try and save some marginal MPs.
Part of Falmer site removed from National Park. Toads Hole Valley added to National Park.
So the best site is removed from consideration and Falmer is doomed.
Who will walk to Falmer?
How will this stadium be a "Community" Stadium?
Albion will not want teams lower than the reserves playing on their grass.
You also forget the award of "Community Club Of The Millenium" or some such nonsense, coincidentally at the same time as the submission was made to Ruth Kelly. I would also like to understand more about the undue "pressure" that Keith Taylor appeared to allude to in a letter / article when discussing the old Labour administration here and the council planning officers.
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 12:14:46
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| Long time no hear Septicman ... how's you been? |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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septicman
Alagaësía
77 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 12:35:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Miriam Binder
Long time no hear Septicman ... how's you been?
I'm well thanks, how about you?
I have to say I'm much better for having given up posting on web message boards, with the recent exception of the Brighton fans forum, North Stand Chat. I had a quick go on there, but I'm over sifting through documents etc. to prove my case about the stadium, or doing endless responses to minor points of detail. So it was a bit pointless really. I didn't see anything that made me feel different about the process, though. Because Prescott's decision was quashed, the only evidence in front of Hazel Blears will be three things:
1. The most recent submissions which I assume will say nothing particularly new;
2. A report that says that there is nowhere in B&H that will get planning permission for the new stadium;
3. An inspectors report that says that the stadium overwhelmingly fails the test of need at Falmer.
Fortunately, just in time for the decision, the area is now proposed to be taken out of the AONB, and the alternative area will be put in.. What a coincidence!
The thing about this whole thing that REALLY bugs me is the feel of the "corruption" of it all. Firstly, it would appear that if you really want to build anything you want anywhere you want you need at least one of two things; money or contacts. If you have both, so much the better. I actually don't give a damn about the stadium at all, but what I really hate is the fact that the club appears to have bullied its way through the process. The real sufferers, as the public enquiry clearly states will be the residents of Falmer; the visitors to the Downs; and the users of Stanmer Park. That will not change at all. There are many more users of the Downs and Park than will ever use the soccer ground.
This wouldn't be the only bit of planning that seems to have just flown through; the Gehry towers; the Marina development; the re-building at the County Cricket Ground (and I love Cricket). All of these things have the feel of someone somewhere making money at someone else's expense, DESPITE their being "safeguards" in place to defend the little people. I am sure the people living in the area of the WTS feel the same way. |
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No Expert
Barsoom
398 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 12:41:06
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| There isn't 1 state school in sussex with a cricket pitch. |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 12:49:37
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Glad to hear you are doing well Septic. I'm fine thank you.
I suppose that when it comes down to it a stadium is wanted by a large number of people. Whether ultimately it will be beneficial to the area or not will remain to be seen.
I accept that corruption has a lot to do with planning applications and development. Whether that is indeed what happened here or not, I cannot say for sure either way. |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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septicman
Alagaësía
77 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 13:34:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Miriam Binder
Glad to hear you are doing well Septic. I'm fine thank you.
I suppose that when it comes down to it a stadium is wanted by a large number of people. Whether ultimately it will be beneficial to the area or not will remain to be seen.
I accept that corruption has a lot to do with planning applications and development. Whether that is indeed what happened here or not, I cannot say for sure either way.
I don't know either.
Unfortunately, what happens if the thing is built and there are no benefits? It's too late then. Lots of things are wanted by lots of people. It doesn't mean it's right for them to get them. |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 13:42:26
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| Utilitarianism has a lot to answer for I suppose. |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 14:02:21
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What does Falmer need?
I believe the biggest bully in the area is the univerity.
That has done nothing for Falmer.
It builds on regardless.
It does nothing for the users of the Downs or Stanmer Park
I see the stadium being small beer in comparision. |
We're all doomed!
Head for the hills before they start heading for you! |
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No Expert
Barsoom
398 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 14:08:24
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| Seconded. The uni site is a mess. |
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sully
Alagaësía
40 Posts |
Posted - 15/07/2007 : 22:23:24
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quote:
Originally posted by septicman
Because Prescott's decision was quashed, the only evidence in front of Hazel Blears will be three things:
1. The most recent submissions which I assume will say nothing particularly new;
2. A report that says that there is nowhere in B&H that will get planning permission for the new stadium;
3. An inspectors report that says that the stadium overwhelmingly fails the test of need at Falmer.
As usual, septic, totally incorrect.
Welcome back!!
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Involved in Scouting?
Take part in the 40th Sussex Downsman Hike. 6 October 2007.
See www.downsman.com for details |
Edited by - sully on 15/07/2007 22:27:49 |
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septicman
Alagaësía
77 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 08:58:25
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Wrong how? Are you talking about the proposed change in AONB boundaries? Have the club submitted new info? Are the issues fundamentally different from what they were? LDC and associates have submitted a report that states that Sheepcote can cope with the traffic. Unless there were to be a public enquiry, the word of LDC is as good as the word of the club. What about the proposed Shoreham development plans? They could have a huge bearing on the location of the stadium....
In regards to massive support for the project, I'm reminded of something that happened at a rain break during the last Wimbledon. During the time off, the BBC ran some sort of poll by text, and on their web site, asking listeners to say who was better, Borg or McEnroe (I think it was), and who would have won more head-to-head encounters etc. Plenty of people participated. The whole thing became rather pointless when an ex-pro came late into the commentary position and mentioned that actually, the whole idea of a vote is flawed as they actually did play against each other a number of times and we have the results. There is no need for guess work or polls, we know the real outcomes of the games!
This remineded me of the referendum. We don't need to guess - we have the attendance figures from the Goldstone and from Withdean, and the Withdean is more than big enough to accommodate the fans that Brighton have, and for the last TEN years at the Goldstone. These are the people that actually are prepared to spend money to watch the team play, which is the real test of people's commitment to the club - and it isn't many. Of course, it is cheaper to watch Chelsea play in some parts of Stamford Bridge than it is to go to the Withdean to watch tier 3 football, which may explain a lot. |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 11:21:27
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| Do you not think the site at Falmer will get built on even if the stadium is rejected? |
We're all doomed!
Head for the hills before they start heading for you! |
Edited by - Daveb on 16/07/2007 11:22:25 |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 11:33:51
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| Of course it will and it should be .... it is a deplorable piece of land as it is at the moment. |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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septicman
Alagaësía
77 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 12:07:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Miriam Binder
Of course it will and it should be .... it is a deplorable piece of land as it is at the moment.
However much you dislike it, the land is currently in AONB, building in it for the wrong reasons sets later precedents.
If the land is to be built on, for the reason of providing jobs (and remember, this is the reason Prescott used, the stadium didn't get approval in its own right), then you have to go with something that provides the maximum number of jobs for the land to be built on. There are plenty of industries that could build on here that would provide more jobs than the stadium. So the stadium couldn't, if viewed objectively, win in that respect either. |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5317 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 12:25:23
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| However much the residents of Falmer may dislike it, they are not living in a different universe from the rest of us. They are no more exempt from the crowding of modern life then the rest of us. That area is not nor has it been for a considerable period of time an AONB in anything but name. That has now been rectified! |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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nightbird
Calaspia
603 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 12:32:37
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The thing that worries me is the Albion will not generate enough income to service such a debt they will have.
Its building will be a stop and start affair for decades, can only see it slowly turning into another retail park to get finance unless Brighton council put our money into it.
Time will tell.... |
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septicman
Alagaësía
77 Posts |
Posted - 16/07/2007 : 12:50:29
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quote:
Originally posted by nightbird
The thing that worries me is the Albion will not generate enough income to service such a debt they will have.
Its building will be a stop and start affair for decades, can only see it slowly turning into another retail park to get finance unless Brighton council put our money into it.
Time will tell....
In theory part of the deal is that there is no further planning permission, however, now the govt. may take the AONB designation away, the club will likely get permission to build whatever they want (like there was ever a doubt). |
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Community Stadium