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FUBAR
Barsoom
391 Posts |
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Tombstone Blues
Discworld
1940 Posts |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5311 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2007 : 12:36:05
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| It's a growth industry ... |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
 Posted - 04/09/2007 : 12:39:04
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Borninhove
Calaspia
934 Posts |
Posted - 04/09/2007 : 13:58:03
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Yes, but you have to admit that this is quite funny, despite the oil moneyquote:
"Since the late 1960s, much of the North Atlantic Ocean has become less salty, in part due to increases in fresh water runoff induced by global warming, scientists say."
LiveScience
June 29, 2005
"The surface waters of the North Atlantic are getting saltier, suggests a new study of records spanning over 50 years. They found that during this time, the layer of water that makes up the top 400 metres has gradually become saltier. The seawater is probably becoming saltier due to global warming."
New Scientist
August 23, 2007
I could do one, too:
There has been a marked increase in the number of Greggs selling 80p tea with fresh milk in the country over the last 10 years. Global warning has been identified as the cause.
The number of tramps in the Rottingdean area has gone into calamitous decline over the last fifty years as the ravages of global warming take hold.
When interviewed at the police station as to why he had superglued his wife and children to the dining-room table, the defendent said that he would never have done such a thing had it not been for global warming.
EvilBushBlairTescoWalmartBrown? Never would have happened if it wasn't for that pesky old global warming.
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 Valhalla, I am coming! |
Edited by - Borninhove on 04/09/2007 14:00:53 |
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FUBAR
Barsoom
391 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 10:25:30
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I posted this as it is on quite a few of the other forums I use. They all say the same thing, "it is sponsered by the oil companies". The problem is that so far no-one has rebutted the arguement, only argued about where the money comes from. So can mere cash taint the results or just the way people see them?  |
I came into the world with nothing and still have most of it left.. |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 10:49:34
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quote:
Originally posted by FUBAR
I posted this as it is on quite a few of the other forums I use. They all say the same thing, "it is sponsered by the oil companies". The problem is that so far no-one has rebutted the arguement, only argued about where the money comes from. So can mere cash taint the results or just the way people see them?
If a scientific paper is well researched by then it will rely on a mixture of empirical evidence and hypo-deductive methods of analysis to draws its conclusions. Papers should not therefore be dismissed simply because they are funded by a particular organization. However there are a number of reports about some scientist being offered considerable sums to write papers refuting accepted climate change theories. You can therefore hardly be surprised at the cynical reactions of the forums on which you have posted.
I doubt people on a forum have rebutted the argument as only a trained scientist specialization in the area is likely to have sufficient knowledge to do so. I certainly cannot understand the complexities of all of the science involved and I have quite a strong interest in the issue.
Of course their will always be dissenting views on matters of scientific theories. Theories are just that theories, and as more research is done then more things become apparent. If you take the vast majority of scientific evidence on climate change then there is a very high probability that climate change does have anthropogenic origins.
I for one would not want to do nothing about the problem based on the findings of one such paper unless over the course of time it was backed up by further research.
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http://www.moon23.wordpress.com
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FUBAR
Barsoom
391 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 11:01:39
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| I didn't find the article but merely pass it on. Most responses have been like TBs, the source of funding affects the research so it must be wrong. But it also affects the way people view it. Just because Exxon sponsered it does that mean it is wrong or that the people reading it are being biased against it because Exxon sponsered it? Facts are facts no matter who pays for them if they are presented as facts not changed or altered to fit an arguement. |
I came into the world with nothing and still have most of it left.. |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 11:41:24
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quote:
Originally posted by FUBAR
I didn't find the article but merely pass it on. Most responses have been like TBs, the source of funding affects the research so it must be wrong. But it also affects the way people view it. Just because Exxon sponsered it does that mean it is wrong or that the people reading it are being biased against it because Exxon sponsered it? Facts are facts no matter who pays for them if they are presented as facts not changed or altered to fit an arguement.
Scientific theory is not fact, it is a model of best fit which best explains external phenomena. Global warming is not 'a fact' it is a theory which best explains what is happening and what is going to happen. This paper is also a theory which suggests there maybe another reason behind the phenomena.
Currently the bulk of research data would suggest that this theory is lacking and unable to fully explain the phenomena. Although perhaps it has identified some of the other factors that combined with Green House gases act as variables on the Earths temperature.
This paper is also not 'a fact'. Have you ever read the Bad Science Column in the Guardian. Although it's quite simplistic it does provide some interesting reading on the subject matter for lay people such as I assume we are (any climate scientist please come forth  ) http://www.badscience.net/
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http://www.moon23.wordpress.com
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Tombstone Blues
Discworld
1940 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 13:02:34
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quote:
Originally posted by FUBAR
I didn't find the article but merely pass it on. Most responses have been like TBs, the source of funding affects the research so it must be wrong. But it also affects the way people view it. Just because Exxon sponsered it does that mean it is wrong or that the people reading it are being biased against it because Exxon sponsered it? Facts are facts no matter who pays for them if they are presented as facts not changed or altered to fit an arguement.
So if a scientist who was funded by the BNP claimed that black people were genetically inferior, you wouldn't be at all sceptical about his conclusions? |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 13:23:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Daveb
From the radio news it seem that scientist/researchers have just completed a study that shows you are more likely to die young if you lead a rock n Roll lifestyle.
Found this link.
http://lifestyle.aol.co.uk/rock-stars-predicted-to-die-young/article/20070903191109990005
It took scientists to work this out!
Strewth!
Who need these ones?
Don't let the government know or they might try and ban rock and roll on health grounds. |
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Borninhove
Calaspia
934 Posts |
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5311 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 16:09:50
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quote:
Originally posted by FUBAR
I didn't find the article but merely pass it on. Most responses have been like TBs, the source of funding affects the research so it must be wrong. But it also affects the way people view it. Just because Exxon sponsered it does that mean it is wrong or that the people reading it are being biased against it because Exxon sponsered it? Facts are facts no matter who pays for them if they are presented as facts not changed or altered to fit an arguement.
It can hardly be totally unbiased now can it? Tobacco companies are unlikely to give more funding to a researcher who's research is starting to point to irrefutable proof that there is a connection between cancer and tobacco products. |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 17:16:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Miriam Binder
quote:
Originally posted by FUBAR
I didn't find the article but merely pass it on. Most responses have been like TBs, the source of funding affects the research so it must be wrong. But it also affects the way people view it. Just because Exxon sponsered it does that mean it is wrong or that the people reading it are being biased against it because Exxon sponsered it? Facts are facts no matter who pays for them if they are presented as facts not changed or altered to fit an arguement.
It can hardly be totally unbiased now can it? Tobacco companies are unlikely to give more funding to a researcher who's research is starting to point to irrefutable proof that there is a connection between cancer and tobacco products.
This is true, compaines are more likely to fund research where the research proposal points in a certain area. For instance researching into sun spots is not going to look at global warming, but it may offer another explanation of the Phenoma. They would be far more likely to fund this.
Good point Mim, it's not that the report it'self is biased just that there are more of these reports created becuase the compaines fund those which research into areas other than Green houses gasses.
Bang on |
http://www.moon23.wordpress.com
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Pennywise
Alagaësía
14 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 19:36:55
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Moons profile:
"I’m also an Environmental campaigner with Friends of the Earth and a Borders Morris dancer. The former helps me to feel I’m giving something back to this beautiful planet we inhabit and the later allows me to dance about like lunatic drinking ale. Well I guess that just about sums me up really."
I'm sorry moon23.
Now I understand and I won't be nasty to you again. |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 20:15:33
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You Ain't Been Nasty PW.
Not by a mile.
Sign Of The Times. |
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camelot
Barsoom
USA
294 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 21:27:40
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quote:
Originally posted by moon23
Scientific theory is not fact, it is a model of best fit which best explains external phenomena. Global warming is not 'a fact' it is a theory which best explains ...
I thought that the earth's temperature increases have been recorded very accurately over time and the data was agreed upon by almost all parties (energy companies included). So for most "global warming" IS a fact...it’s the cause of the warm-up that's being debated. Oil companies are not in a rush to be blamed for it, so they will fund studies that present their side of the story. They will probably not publish studies that are "off message" even if the study produces evidence of a hydrocarbon cause. |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 21:36:21
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The Problem with all this
is even without all this Pollution/Corruption.
The World Shape & Weather
could go like this anyway.
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Miriam Binder
Earthsea
United Kingdom
5311 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 05:34:22
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There is no doubt that weather patterns are changing globally. To an extent climatic conditions are naturally cyclic. I have no doubt that industrialisation has, to an extent, contributed to this. To what extent it has contributed is something we may never know for certain.
This bandwagon hopping is merely a form of mass hysteria fuelled by environmental fanatics on the one hand and fed by capital driven industrialist on the other. |
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin |
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FUBAR
Barsoom
391 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 10:07:51
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I can see in a few years people running around shouting "UNGREEN, UNGREEN" at non believers. |
I came into the world with nothing and still have most of it left.. |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 12:36:17
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quote:
Originally posted by camelot
quote:
Originally posted by moon23
Scientific theory is not fact, it is a model of best fit which best explains external phenomena. Global warming is not 'a fact' it is a theory which best explains ...
I thought that the earth's temperature increases have been recorded very accurately over time and the data was agreed upon by almost all parties (energy companies included). So for most "global warming" IS a fact...it’s the cause of the warm-up that's being debated. Oil companies are not in a rush to be blamed for it, so they will fund studies that present their side of the story. They will probably not publish studies that are "off message" even if the study produces evidence of a hydrocarbon cause.
Yes sorry you are right. |
http://www.moon23.wordpress.com
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 12:37:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Pennywise
Moons profile:
"I’m also an Environmental campaigner with Friends of the Earth and a Borders Morris dancer. The former helps me to feel I’m giving something back to this beautiful planet we inhabit and the later allows me to dance about like lunatic drinking ale. Well I guess that just about sums me up really."
I'm sorry moon23.
Now I understand and I won't be nasty to you again.
Yes, or i'll set a pack of Morris dancers on you.  |
http://www.moon23.wordpress.com
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2007 : 19:27:55
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This is down to New Labour having Control of the BBC Charter.
Making the BBC - Waste of time. |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2007 : 19:30:30
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On Ch4 at 7:30PM tonight was
The Green Debate.
Ch4 miles above the bbc.
And Unlike the BBC can be watched free on the Internet. |
Edited by - long time no see on 07/09/2007 20:03:59 |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2007 : 19:41:07
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What a great debate
One view on the Ch4 Debate
was 'to help nations in poverty
because what is going on now with the world weather can not be stopped.'
''Institute Of Economics'' Mark Pennington
And No Adds on it.
Tony Juniper made some good comments
and Michael Meacher MP.
But Dr. Vicky Pope saying if we do not do something it will get worse
'hotter.'
What a fool she is
it has gone past that
it has started 'The Weather Changes'
no nation can Stop it.
And one thing for sure
the World Nations are Not united on this. |
Edited by - long time no see on 07/09/2007 20:02:44 |
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long time no see
Earthsea
United Kingdom
6439 Posts |
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Daveb
Discworld
1895 Posts |
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moon23
Calaspia
699 Posts |
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Topic |
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Global Warming........
